Gender Nonconformity vs. Sexual Orientation

5/21/2013

Recently I was talking to someone I respect a great deal, and she said something I've often thought as well: many people are more uncomfortable with gender nonconformity than with homosexuality. Of course, the two often go hand in hand. But let's assume, for a moment, that we can disaggregate them.

In my work circles, which mostly comprise upper-middle-class NPR listeners, few people care if your partner is male or female. Same-sex partnership is still noteworthy, interesting, and a titillating gossip source to some people, but for the most part, it's not a big issue. Homos abound at high levels in my profession, and most are pretty open. But I have trouble coming up with examples of high-powered women in my profession who wear mostly men's clothing. If you're a woman giving a conference talk, it's not that big a deal to mention your same-sex partner. It is a big deal to wear a necktie. No one else does it, and you're likely to be seen as "making a statement."

For me, this begs two questions: (1) Why?; (2) What implications does this have for my own self-presentation? Today, I'll write about the former.

Here's my guess: looking gender-conforming still adheres to people's ideas and assumptions about gender--the idea that men "are" and "look" a certain way, and that women "are" and "look" a different way. If we define homosexuality narrowly (as I think most people do, particularly non-queers), it only challenges one aspect of gender typicality: whom you sleep with.

It's as if are only two kinds of ice cream, and ice cream always comes in double scoops: one vanilla, one chocolate. This is what most people always order, then later they learn that some people order two scoops of vanilla or two scoops of chocolate. "Fine," they think. "Some people like two scoops of the same thing. But there are still just two kinds of ice cream."

In contrast, if someone orders vanilla with chocolate swirls and says, "It's still vanilla--it just has chocolate swirls in it," (or if, God forbid, they order strawberry) this challenges people's fundamental ideas about the kinds of ice cream that exist.

In this way, gender nonconformists mess with people's categories. A woman in a tie, when only men are wearing ties, is like chocolate chip ice cream. "What IS that?" people think. "No flavor I've ever seen." This is probably why, as Kristen Schilt writes in One of the Guys, when people go from identifying as butch women to identifying as trans men, they become more accepted in the workplace. As butch women, people viewed them as gender atypical. When they become trans men, people can say, "Oh, I kind of understand--you were really chocolate all along!"

As more states adopt legal protections based on sexual orientation, I think gender conformity will be one of the next frontiers. This is closely tied--though not identical--to the fight for trans rights, providing another reason to help fight for the rights of all other queers, not just your personal subset.

For now, I'll leave the conversation there. What do you think, dear readers? In your everyday work lives, what's people's reaction to sexual orientation versus gender nonconformity?

37 Comments

Kate

5/21/2013 07:40:37 am

I think you're exactly right about this -- and, I'd go as far as to put forth this non-PC statement, that the discomfort with gender nonconformity extends to our own community and is the reason why some younger lesbians consider transitioning before learning to be comfortable with presenting as a masculine-looking females. As you know, it takes a certain amount of ego-strength to stand up in a suit in a room full of people who make assumptions about you based on how they *think* you should look based on your gender (or, more accurately, your genitalia).

I realize that this is a hugely provocative (and blanket) statement. There are, of course, different flavors of this -- to stick with your ice cream metaphor -- but it's something I think about often as I see fewer and fewer younger butches and more and more trans men. For a while, I asked these guys why they transitioned -- or were transitioning -- and I was surprised by the answer I often received which was a variation on, "I'm exploring the boundaries of gender." When I'd press deeper (I make my living as a nonfiction writer and have no issues questioning random strangers!), and ask if these men meant the boundaries of gender or the boundaries of gender presentation, they often confessed to not considering the latter. Admittedly, I have not spoken to a statistically significant number of folks and the responses are wholly anecdotal, but I think it's something worth talking about.

Before any of your readers flame me, please know that I am a non-gender conforming butch woman. I work primarily with male professionals, so to walk into a conference room in a suit and wingtips takes a certain amount of self-possession, giving me a personal understanding of the discomfort and work involved in dealing with issues of gender presentation. I don't mean to disparage anyone's sexual or gender journey, but I truly think we need to talk about this. Thanks for starting the conversation.

Joni

5/21/2013 08:50:41 am

Well said Kate!

tracy

5/21/2013 09:30:20 am

very well said Kate, my girlfriend and I agree fully.

Kyle

5/22/2013 10:41:12 am

Kate, as a rather young transguy, similar to those you mentioned, this really struck a chord, so thank you; I'm still fairly confident in my own choice that transition is right for me, but I will still regularly read things like this blog, to challenge my thinking and make sure that I'm sure.

However, I would definitely say that, although standing up and owning a butch identity takes a lot of courage, I wouldn't say that transitioning takes less courage; I know I'm going to face years of uncomfortable psychiatric appointments, a number of painful ops and a lifetime of injections, as well as having to stand up in what others see as gender nonconforming clothes (I really don't pass very well, more's the pity). But, to be fair to you, as BW said, I do have the privilege of being able to explain that, hey, I was "chocolate all along" whereas butch women don't. I don't know if you meant to give the impression that butch women must be braver than transguys, so sorry if I've misunderstood you a little.

Must say, I'd definitely be interested in discussing this further - like I said, I'm only young still (18) and welcome any chance to understand myself and others better!

6/4/2013 09:13:33 am

Hey, Kyle -- In *no way* do I mean to imply that trans folks are not brave -- or that butch women are somehow more brave -- far from it. I think we all are incredibly brave in different ways. What I mean to say is that there seems to be a group that jumps straight (pardon the pun) to transitioning, rather than sitting with the discomfort of gender nonconformity.

And, oh, I seem to be repeating myself here -- so let me see if I can phrase it differently. I think that because there are about 231 different permutations between M and F and that gender is -- in many ways -- a social construct, what would happen if we simply accepted ourselves and presentation as-is. As in, I am phenomenally butch, but I also have bigger breasts and cry very easily. It doesn't, IMHO, make me less masculine or more feminine. And none of those qualities make me fit better in the mainstream perception of gender -- if anything it confuses people worse. What I've had to do -- and please understand, Kyle, that this is only *my* journey (although I do think it's something we all have to do) -- is learn to be comfortable with the discomfort of others and myself. It's incredibly psychically uncomfortable and takes an incredible amount of presence most days.

I don't have any body dysmorphia. That might change things for me. I like being a butch with tits because it challenges the gender assumption (even as it makes it hard to buy clothes as the most recent BW post points out. Plug for Tomboy Tailors and St. Harridan. They'll make clothes that fit!). Ultimately, what I am saying is that I think as a culture we often want a quick fix that alleviates that psychic discomfort, rather than learning to deal with it and love ourselves. Does that make sense?

If you want to email me about this offline, I'm sure BW will give you my email address and we can discuss more. I suspect we both have a lot to teach each other.

Kate

Tina

6/4/2013 12:34:31 pm

Kate -your last posting is brilliant thank you, I so much agree with you...

Nick Torres

5/21/2013 07:43:33 am

I ahve been sooo lucky to work at a place where neither one is looked at sideways. I am genderqueer and female oriented, and I have had only one comment in 7 years, and that was from a new parent, who said "Ok, be gay, but can't you fix yourself up a little?" Immediately, my boss, my co workers, and other parents JUMPED to my defense. Oh, have I mentioned I work in a daycare center???

Judy Benson

5/22/2013 06:22:36 am

The comment that grabbed my attention is .."fix yourself up a little? ..." Are serious butches broken ?

Philly

5/21/2013 07:44:07 am

Several times I've heard people that I know to be very homophobic saying that they suppose it would be ok to be gay just so long as you don't "act like it." And these people are the same ones that I know use religion to justify their homophobia. So what they are basically saying is that they don't really care if what they think of as sin is happening just so long as they aren't personally creeped out by something they're not used to yet.

Dylan

5/21/2013 08:45:13 am

I work as a bus driver so very easy to wear the men's uniform including neck tie. I still get stared at and people exclaiming 'you're not a man' like I tried to trick them. I just feel better in mens clothes. I don't want to change sex though i'm just somewhere in between.

Alison

5/21/2013 09:02:44 am

I totally agree with Kate, and with this blog post! Thanks for raising this issue. Another example of it is that if a femme woman walks into a public women's restroom with a shirt that reads, "I'm gay!" or something, people would probably not do anything (at least where I live). But every single freakin' time I walk into a public women's restroom, as a butch woman, I get frightened, weird looks from people, and sometimes even bluntly rude or mean comments. So yeah, I think gender nonconformity really does push people's buttons and is hard for many to accept.

5/21/2013 09:49:48 am

Alison -- I totally get the bathroom issue. A friend of mine always walks in talking so that women will hear her high voice first, see her butch body second. I don't have that luxury because my voice is incredibly deep. So, I usually just keep my head down and dash for the stalls.

The flip side is when shopping in the men's department, clerks ultimately realize I'm a woman and then freak out that they've called me sir. Their response is either chagrin or anger that -- I can only assume -- they feel somehow deceived by me. I used to feel deep shame that I was routinely mistaken for a man. Now I relish it. I figure it's proof positive of my good-looking butch stature. ;>)

Mary L. White

5/21/2013 09:41:57 am

I had a lesbian friend who told me that she and other lesbians in our area did not believe I was a lesbian even if I said so. I didn't have a partner at the time and I have very long hair that I wear braided and coiled on my head. Then there was another friend who insisted I had to be a femme because of my appearance, totally ignoring my abilities in several male identified activities related to farm work. I don't identify as femme or butch, I do accept the label lesbian.
I knew someone who studied gender with Minnie Bruce Pratt. This friend came to the conclusion that there are too few categories. Male, female, gay, straight that's nowhere near enough to describe the huge variations in life and style of all people.

5/30/2013 02:40:48 am

Rock on, Mary! I'm in a similar situation. I briefly explored transgenderism as I really do not consider myself either masculine or feminine--I was hoping this community would present more choices; however, when I went to a group meeting, I had to claim to be 'MTF' or 'FTM'. I crossed out both and wrote 'Large Woodland Mammal'. This was 20 yrs ago and I think the community has evolved, but the adherence to a masculine/feminine or butch/femme linear continuum does not seem like a good approach to me. It's like saying, "Hey, if you aren't Chinese, or British...you must be Chinese-British". Some of us are actually Kenyan. Or American.

I've heard that some Native American tribes acknowledged as many as seven genders. I figure that's a good start.

Keep the faith, and be yourself. Sorry your friends are a bit myopic.

Jamie Ray link

5/21/2013 11:20:09 am

The more "formal" the situation, the more difficult it is for me to find an authentic butch way to be. Walk the dog, casual dinner out, hanging out with friends, no problem. Work, fancy party/function, professional conference, big problem.

The more "adult" the function, the more of a divergence there is between what "women" wear and what "men" wear - and it makes it harder to find something masculine that looks "right" rather than just butch. Mostly I try to avoid anything I can't wear jeans or chino's to. Too much dysphoria otherwise.

6/7/2013 07:14:36 am

I understand this feeling. Fancy occasions are really the only time I've had a hard time feeling comfortable in what I wear, especially professional situations. I've found a lot of clothing I like at Brooks Brothers. It is expensive, but for the right situation it works for me. Their clothing is relatively androgynous except for when they try to get trendy. I will often wear their men's pants with women's but on downs (the loose fit) and a women's jacket, because that is what fits my body.

5/21/2013 07:03:23 pm

Back in February I had an unpleasant experience with a female restroom attendant at Wimbledon shopping mall. She actually asked my if I was a man or a woman. Once I spoke to her in a female voice asking why she was asking and that was very rude it should have been enough. She persisted, she just wanted me to dignify her with an answer. If she really thought I was a crazy guy i've got her cornered and she's challenging me. I think her boss would have her call security not challenge me. Really I only have my hair cut short so it's not like i'm asking for these comments. It's one thing with the public but another thing when people think they can discriminate and become judgemental and rude at work and keep their jobs.

Jax link

5/22/2013 02:10:26 am

I'm about to find out just how tolerant my workplace truly is. Tomorrow I give a big presentation which is the second to last step to complete training. I struggled with what to wear. Ultimately my wife told me to get dark gray pants and vest, a lighter colored shirt (blue and white small checkers) and tie. But I didn't like the tie look so I got an orange bow tie! I'm very excited, but hoping it balances my being butch (and looking ridiculous in anything remotely feminine) but not completely masculine with a coat. really the only thing I worry about is if they worry that I would confuse clients and make them uncomfortable. Granted, in reality I just wear polo shirts or button up shirts at work, but it's recommended to dress one level above your current level to show motivation.

It's a really challenging issue, one I face every time I have an interview as well.

I think anyone who's dealt with being gender variant has faced this many times and will agree, without a second thought, that gender is far harder to accept than sexuality. What helps is being confident but not pushy, and recognize that your mere existence challenges people's long held beliefs. Very rarely do they mean to be an asshole. While we may be the receiving end of their issues, handling them with compassion and kindness goes a long way toward being accepted yourself.

5/23/2013 07:24:32 am

As a quick follow-up, I did my presentation today. No one had anything bad to say about my outfit. I got a few compliments, including one of the older guys who asked where my bow tie was later because it looked sharp. (it's too hot to wear all the clothes all day lol)

I'm proud of the place I work. I've never seen them force gender, and I'm not the only butch here. Another has been working here for quite a few years. I'm grateful to work at two companies so far who have allowed me to just be me. I hope that spreads to other companies as well.

5/23/2013 07:35:37 am

5/22/2013 02:14:13 am

Totally agree great post as always! Being genderqueer or gender nonconforming is much more threatening to conventional people than being gay or lesbian I think because it threatens their interpretation of and acceptance of binary gender and traditional gender roles. People are not born wearing clothing, the whole concept of mens and womens clothing is created by people. A man wearing a dress and high heels and makeup is not dressing like a woman, he is a man wearing a dress and high heels and makeup. Similarly, there is no reason that a tie is something masculine other than the fact that this is how our culture defines it. And I completely agree about butch women who become transmen, this to me is the opposite of being genderqueer and very conservative in nature. Being genderqueer means that you can feel that you are neither male nor female or both or a combination of both regardless of what your body looks like or how you dress. Butch clothing is not inherently "masculine" at all, it's just a style as are other styles.

Alice

7/8/2014 05:55:33 am

I wish I knew of a less technical-sounding adjective than androgynous that was in the same area, something on the level of butch or femme. I oscillate in the area "between" agender and female and often find it hard to find adjectives that "feel right" unless I use "nerd" as a gender related adjective.

David

5/22/2013 04:05:14 am

This is a hugely validating and helpful blog to read, and honestly each and every comment resonates in some way. Attesting to the variety of experience - not only variations among us, but the various reactions we get in our own life.

I'm a bit befuddled at how to respond because I went from "soft butch" to FTM. I'm in transition currently. And after most people got over the initial shock (I'm in my mid-40s, with 20+ years as an out lesbian, happily married until transition), the feedback I get is "of course you're a guy." Or, "you were never exactly feminine." All true.

I've gotten incredible support and acceptance, from a variety of unexpected corners.

And yet your ice-cream metaphor stays with me, because everyone wants to categorize me as chocolate now. I was she, know I'm he. Move from box A to box B.

I'm transitioning because I wanted the internal and external to match. I needed to masculinize in order to feel like I was - in retrospect - in the "right body." But calling myself a "man" feels a bit disengenuous - at least so far.

I still feel like the "old" me, think like the old "me," and so on. What's changed is the exterior and some thought processess, but it's hardly like I've gone through an internal wholesale shift.

So how does that make me a man? I'm not sure it does. And I'm ok with that.

But the most-often question I get is "so are you still attracted to women?" Um, yes. "Does that make you straight?" It makes me, well, me! Those boxes again.

Before I close, though, one shout out to an evolving lesbian community. Once upon a time, my decision to transition would have had me shunned from my longtime community. Such is largely not the case anymore, suggesting at that least the LGBTQI community and its allies are working to evolve.

For all this and more, I'm grateful.

5/23/2013 04:55:06 am

My question for the transmen here, why do you feel that your body and mind have to match? I feel that your body and your match not matching or not matching completely is truly genderqueer and something that should be ok to live with. To me, changing your body so it matches your mind is giving in to mainstream ideas about binary gender - you're male or you're female. I don't think we are, I think being genderqueer is normal. I can't stand it when people who are born intersexed are given surgery to make them into either a male or a female physically. I'm not criticizing your decisions to transition, it's your body, but I think too many people are thinking they have to do this rather than live comfortably as a gender hybrid.

Hollis

5/30/2013 06:59:31 am

First, I'm a genderqueer person. Second, I have massive amounts of dysphoria some days and I'm looking at top surgery because dysphoria is not fun at all. It's a pretty motivating thing to do something so you stop being ridiculously uncomfortable.

kazerniel

5/31/2013 08:42:37 am

Hey, non-binary trans guy here. Answering your question: I feel like my body and mind "have" to match because I'm very dysphoric about my chest and periods and being constantly regarded as a female in society (I don't pass in 99% of the time, because I'm not on HRT yet). Basically I just want to be comfortable and happy in my body and the way people relate to me. And the way to that (for me) is to transition. I'm not fully male, but kind of fluid among male, genderqueer and genderless, but I'm comfortable enough in the binary male gender role, that I use male pronouns and picked a male name and altogether present as binary trans male to everyone outside the queer community. I prefer to avoid "clashes" with society that wouldn't increase my wellbeing that much (eg. using non-binary pronouns or title, or being open about my non-binaryness to cis-hetero people.)

5/31/2013 02:09:09 pm

I totally understand what you are saying and respect it but I guess I'm different, I would see transitioning as giving in to their prejudices, changing myself to avoid other peoples' ignorance and meanness, conforming to their ideas of male and female to avoid pain. I wish people wouldn't let others make them feel so bad about themselves and their bodies

6/1/2013 05:53:07 am

It doesn't let me reply to your last comment Tina, so writing here:
Sorry, I forgot to specify; my chest- and period dysphoria are bodily dysphoria, meaning I would hate them even if I lived on a deserted island, it's not just that society misgenders me because of my chest, but the innate feeling that "they shouldn't be there". I stopped doing any physical activity as my breasts grew during puberty because I hated as they moved and made me conscious of their presence, even though it took me until age 23 that I realised I was trans.

Anders

6/1/2013 09:54:49 am

I feel like you answered your own question here. I'm a completely male-identified trans man, and while I do feel the need to go through some medical transition steps I am also comfortable having some traditionally female-associated body parts. I do not feel like these parts are female when they are on *my* body, and I do not feel that they make me anything more than male or any sort of 'gender hybrid'. The fact that others do, however, does make me uncomfortable.

Also, for me being seen as female is like wearing someone else's clothes or wearing a name tag with the wrong name on it 24/7. It's a constant impedance to social interaction and self-expression, and unless you're very vocal about who you are it can make you invisible.

Womandrogyne

5/23/2013 05:40:33 am

Thought-provoking as ever. I'm intrigued by this point that the more formal you go, the more gender-distinction is expected in presentation. My impression (and I'm speaking as a somewhat non-binary butch - and therefore gender-nonconforming - trans woman here) is that gender identity is one of the deepest/strongest ways that people identify themselves, and that we do identity in relation to others, so it's very challenging to see the "rules broken", as it threatens people's unconscious idea of their own position. I get this often too, the complete stranger thinking it's reasonable to come up to me and question my gender and/or genitalia, and the fact that it seems to make people angry to be unsure what I am, like I'm doing it on purpose to upset them. As for public loos (sorry, I'm a Brit), I've never had trouble, in spite of being 6'3", and my approach has always been to walk in with a beaming smile on my face. When people actually bother to look at me, they just smile back. I suspect what's often happening in public loos is not to do with gender preconceptions so much as perceived threat, which is why I do the smile thing.

As for gender-nonconforming vs. gender transition, each person is different, of course, and has different motives. Yes, I expect there are people who identify as trans men who simply found it safer to transition than to live as butch women, but the majority are men who got a bad deal on their anatomy and are finally addressing that - often after a long period living as a butch woman because *that* felt safer than transitioning. In this culture, they're both scary positions to be in. It's also pretty scary being a butch trans woman, or a femme trans man, or gender non-binary, or in some places, a femme dyke - anything off the middle of the bell curves.

"Orange Mike" Lowrey

5/23/2013 06:38:18 am

Speaking as a gentle straight guy who occasionally got called "faggot" until I stopped shaving, even though I never crossdressed: I think the biggest thing is that we're talking about fighting the fiercest kind of cultural conditioning, which is that applied to small children who do the "wrong" thing for their gender. Parents totally freak when the kid transgresses those lines, and that kind of nearly-terrified reaction goes deep inside our psyches.

Kevin

5/23/2013 04:26:13 pm

While the example of a woman wearing a necktie is interesting and relevant, it is not unheard of for women to wear such things. How about a man who wants to wear "women's" clothing such as a skirt or heels at a business conference? Much harder. Women - straight, gay, or otherwise - have been adopting men's fashions for decades, so it's easier for straights to accept them wearing same without bursting their mental bubbles. But a man in a skirt, well, that simply can't be ignored or accepted as easily. It either becomes ostracizing, or a punchline a la Corporal Klinger. I'm just a straight guy who has friends who span many spectra, so I find it interesting to see people's social reactions to the unexpected.

anna

5/24/2013 11:42:26 am

I'm pretty much new to this site. I found it by accident actually and now I'm hooked. My comment is slightly off topic. I was reading and had to leave a comment. I'm not butch myself I am bi and I'm very much girly. I was at work the other day and my girlfriend visited and I'm not in the closet or at all shy about who or what I am. Any how a coworker told me she felt that I trick people because I don't look like most lesbians. She said she did not mind the gay thing but since I did not announce it or look or dress gay she was uncomfortable around me. My first thought was this lady is a idiot. I'm not sure what she thinks the typical gay woman should look like but I'm going to show up monday morning looking like me. Dressing like me. It took me a long time to get comfortable in my own skin, dressing and looking how I want and if that offends or makes anyone uncomfortable..... Oh well . My point is every one has a opinion and you can't make everyone happy so you should just try and make you happy. If you want to wear a tie , wear a tie.

Jan link

5/25/2013 01:12:39 am

Great post. I have lesbian acquaintances who've said that if they ever had children it would NOT be okay if they were transgendered. As a mom, myself, and one who lived a straight lifestyle, married to my sons' dad until they were teenagers, there's little, to me, that is worse than not letting people just be who they are. As a parent I know the fear is that your child will be marginalized, and I experienced that fear when my 19-year-old was five. He liked to play dress-up as his favorite character, Mary Poppins, and, as best I could, I let him do his thing (For a while, I was nervous about his love of her white lace ensemble, preferring that he play in the tailored navy. If you're interested, I tell the story here: https://mothlit.wordpress.com/2012/11/19/a-question/). But I remember watching an Oprah show on kids who cross-dress, and the guest speaker said that of those children, 1/3 would be straight, 1/3 gay, and 1/3 transgendered. My mental plea was "gay or straight, gay or straight, NOT trans," and not because I would love him less, but because I worried about the level of marginalization. He's gay, as it turns out, and pretty confident; says he's going to be the first gay president :) So I imagine now that he'd have been just fine if trans. His confidence brims from living a childhood and school experience of total acceptance; not once, so far, has he felt anyone's judgment or prejudice. Would that the same were true for any of our transgendered humanity.

5/25/2013 05:36:40 am

I'm going to post this under the generic X to protect someone. This post will be from the somewhat opposite side of the gender spectrum. I, a ciswoman femme, am dating a transwoman femme for the first time in my life. Previously, I only dated androgynous and butch ciswomen before, so this is a very new thing and I'm learning a lot.

She is incredibly strong young woman, having transitioned so young (she's still young) and also knowing she was gay. It took me a long time to come out just as gay (I'm older)!

One of the things she said the other day that was both so sad and yet so accurate was that she felt uncomfortable at times in the lesbian world because people disparage the femininity that she worked so hard to achieve and have for herself. She's now everything she wanted and needed to be and now she's invisible and at times feels unwanted and uncomfortable in the lesbian scene. For her, femininity is something she fought for and won, after years of disparaging remarks, cruel taunts, and more.

She went to prom with a transman in her class. No one had any issues with the transman wearing a tux, but everyone had an issue with her (both were pre-transition) wearing a dress. This is not in any way to say it's easier to be a transman or a butch woman. I know it's not.

She's very out about being gay. She's stealth about being trans and is correctly gender identified in her daily life (even though I knew from the start). However, she still cries on my shoulder sometime because it hurts her seeing that the femininity she fought so hard to have, to achieve, now makes her someone to scoff at, ignore and question, this time in the queer community. I've told her part of the reason butches are so celebrated in queer spaces are because they aren't in their daily lives. I understand that. But as a fellow femme woman who gets taken for straight on a daily basis, I understand her issues and questions.

Estel

6/8/2013 10:36:14 pm

Late comment here, but:
I appreciate your separating of gender nonconformity and sexual orientation, because their conflation always leaves me out of place.

I'm gender-nonconforming - female, but for instance more comfortable with men's clothing than with women's clothing, but I'm not lesbian or even bi; I'm closer to straight or asexual, though I find none of the readily available sexual orientation boxes quite fits, and I don't feel I need one. Because I'm not significantly attracted to women, I feel uncomfortable with calling myself butch, because that carries a strong connotation of lesbian. (It also means that many resources I draw on, including this one, are clearly aimed at audiences that I'm outside the core focus of - whether they're aimed at men, or at butch lesbians, or at FTM trans people, they're basically aimed at an audience that doesn't really include me, though I can draw useful things from them.)

I have not yet ventured into wearing suits and ties - that's something I am working on right now - so I don't know how people will respond; it's kind of intimidating. These days I usually dress at the "chinos and button-up shirt" level, which has never gotten me any harrassment.

Ophy

10/10/2017 09:25:27 pm

Sorry for the super late comment here but I've been searching and searching recently for anything related to gender nonconformity but separated from sexuality. This is one of the first things I ran across and I'm glad it was. I just wanted to add a comment regarding your statements because I am the same way. And I just honestly wanted to say thank you for posting because I had yet to find anything that I felt I could relate to in regards to this subject.

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