I recently read this story in the New York Times about a photographer who takes pictures of old animals. I find the pictures beautiful, and they made me think about aging. I've long thought societies that revere and cherish older people have gotten it right. I live in the U.S., where people start saying they're "getting old" in their thirties or forties, where people love getting carded, and where it's considered insulting for someone to guess that a person (especially a woman) is older than she really is.
I'd like to think that the lesbian community is different, and that we have tons of respect for the older (by "older," I mean 60s or 70s plus) dykes among us. But I'm not sure this is true. More than once, I've heard people my own age (30s) talk disparagingly about older lesbians, saying that they don't "get it" with regards to boi culture, or trans culture, or some other aspect of contemporary queer life. (And, to be fair, I've occasionally heard older lesbians say disparaging things about queer youth culture, too.) Why does this age divide exist? Maybe because LGBTQ history and culture have evolved so rapidly in the last 50 years. Maybe those who came of age in the Stonewall era share less with their younger counterparts than is true for straight people. I don't think so, though; I suspect it's a manifestation of a broader tendency to dismiss older people rather than integrating them into society and seeking their wisdom. And why does this tendency exist? Are we obsessed with "progress," which we conflate with youth and newness? Does hanging out with old people scare us because we don't understand it? Does it force us to confront our own mortality? It's especially important for the LGBTQ community to take care of its older members, because in many ways, it's harder to be an old dyke than it is to be an old straight woman. Here are a few reasons why:
Do you ever hang out with older lesbians? What's it like? Tell us about your experiences: positive, negative, whatever. And if you're a 60+ lesbian reading this blog, I'd love to hear your perspective about younger queers.
24 Comments
Nancy Burgess
1/3/2012 06:13:36 am
Im one of those older Dykes and agree with everything youve said. Where I live like other places have always had cliques and that seems to be more evident as I age. I only see some of the wimmin from my communtiee at the Michigan Womyns Music Festival in August.
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Judy Benson
1/3/2012 06:30:19 am
Do we take an interest in the young...?? If I am the old one, the wise one, it is my job to nurture the future generation and help their road be an easier one. What do they owe me ?? I would not want to be ignored. Sometimes it feels as if I am excluded.
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Maude Hills
8/26/2017 04:03:25 pm
Sad how we get pigen holed as "playing roles" I'm. a 61 year old femme who is looking for my stone butch prince charming
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Judy Benson
1/3/2012 06:27:24 am
I am a 65 year old butch, and I must say I usually get treated well. I can still get out and about and participate in a large variety of things. I don't know if others are all that interested in me , but when working on projects we do form a bond. I think in certain situations (late night at a bar or party when everyone is cruising or when couples are having interaction) I sometimes feel as if I am in the way. Sometimes old dykes get very locked into values and process and won't make an effort to accommodate changes in the culture.
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1/3/2012 06:28:13 am
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Rebecca Freeman
1/3/2012 06:42:16 am
I'm a 33 year old femme, married for six years to a 61 year old butch. I hang out almost exclusively with my partner's friends, and people closer to hys age than mine. I see some very different perceptions on either side of the generation gap. Older lesbians tend to see the younger folks as 'having it easy', and don't respect the struggles we have had (since theirs are perceived as harder). Younger lesbians tend to see older lesbians as too tied up in the past, and not accepting of changes in the culture. Even though I'm younger, I prefer the company of older butches (and femmes, to be honest), both romantically and platonically - there are not as many dramas going on, the focus is more on finding likeness and compromise, and less on drama and trying to find your place. Younger folks aren't as secure, for the most part, in their identity and seem to need that friction to wear down the edges. Older lesbians are typically more secure in their identity, and like to find aspects of themselves mirrored in the people they spend time with.
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Judy Benson
1/3/2012 06:52:14 am
I agree about older lesbians being to tied up in the past. They don't make enough of an effort to accommodate changes in the culture.
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Michelle
1/3/2012 07:16:29 am
Who isn't stuck in the past when anyone (gay or straight) gets to that age?! When I sit down to talk to members of my family in their 70's all they do it talk about that past. I would rather sit down and hang out with an "older lesbian" then go hang out at bar, but in so many communities that I have lived in there is only the one gay bar to go to. And it's all about who is dating who and lesbian drama. I am single gay person who can't wait to get older!
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Judy Benson
1/3/2012 07:28:57 am
As a 65 year old I have an obligation to keep improving and not get stuck in the past. The young may also have an obligation to learn from the past ! Also, there are many LGBT service organizations where you can meet a variety of people in a non bar setting.
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Quik
1/3/2012 10:07:33 am
I guess I must be off, then, because I would love a chance to spend more time hanging out with older lesbians, older queers of all stripes. Yes, I do think the culture has changed quickly and that some of the folks who were on the front lines, radicals, in the 60 70's have down a reluctance or inability to recognize some of those changes, but as the younger generation, we are guilty of not bothering to learn from them or engage them and show them what we have in common instead of what makes us different. I'm 29 now, and I guess I have always had more reference for older lgbt folks. When I was 16 I read Odd Girls and Twilight Lovers, and got some (apparently rare) historical perspective...but I live in a town where any dykes are hard to find, much less a specific subset. Sorry for any typos, just typed all this on my phone
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JD
1/3/2012 03:14:26 pm
There is a film called Gen Silent (won Frameline this year) that is being streamed now for free for the next day or so. This is not a promotion - I don't know the filmmakers. It's about the senior LGBTQ community who faces an incredible amount of discrimination. Just read your post and thought it would be interesting for your readers to watch.
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JD
1/3/2012 03:15:22 pm
Sorry, streamed free until Jan 8th at http://stumaddux.com/XDO_Viewer_2.html
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Carrie
1/4/2012 08:48:28 pm
Watched Gen Silent a couple of days ago. Brought to tears many, many times. We need to get with the program, pronto. as many of us aren't that far away from this. As a trans lesbian pushing 60, I am all too aware of this. Trying to organize in my community is an uphill battle but worth doing. As long as I can keep a roof over my head.
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bev
1/3/2012 04:31:12 pm
hi I guess it depends on the woman point of view some older lesbain I went with for a meal often talk about their garden as a group this does not intrest me at all in fact put me to sleep , but other I love hanging with she is 70 and she arrange event for lesbain women of any age she is a little pocket rocket , she bring a smile to my face every time I see her and she always up for a dance and she talks about what happen in the world now so that kool but I guess like me she came out at a older age and has not have to fight for her right so yes she does not get the boi thing at first but she willing to accept people for who they are and she give the best huggs so it a bonus to have this women in my life and able to call her a freind.. lady no 2 is a 60yrs old lesbain who is only out to certain people so if we have to go into her work we are not allowed to say hi esp if we fit the butch look or dyke but that is her choice but she was running a les group it was surpose to be a joint decision what we did but the older women see to not like what we choose but we went along with what they wanted so alot of younger women got bored doing the same thing and left and sadly we dont want it to close but as more young people are not having a say so sadly it will disapear, no 3 womyn is a femminist and has allway been a gold star lesbain and I love learning about gay history in Australia , she will not like being called a guy because like she said at a lesbain dance the dj said thankyou guys all for coming she got mad and said as you can clearly see we are not guy s , I have fought for women right, gay right and have and will fight for us to be called women !!! so listen to here and her story make me proud and in my studies if i can talk about gay right or do a prestation i will help people understand I do not have all the right they do and thank to this woman she made me love who I'am and what I'am and made me realize to look at diffrent subject that effect me like her in Aussie I can not go in a chemmist and ask do they sell dental dam I have to explain what they are and they normaly pull me aside and ask me to be quite and explain to them yes lesbain have many mental health issue depresion is one of them to many to mention we tend to push them under the rug and not talk about them and then older lesbain and gay can not look after themself so they go in a home alot of older lesbain are not out so how do you tell the nursing home that my wife, my lover , she is my life when you have hidden it from your family cause they would not accept you back then and coming out now is to hard cause you might loose your family so I say no we do not look after the older gay people enough we do not realise what they have to fight for we tend to take for granted and it is only when our love one get sick or hurt do we realise how many right we dont have my g/f kids I loved them very much and miss seeing them grow up I have no right to say I want to be in their life like their father has more right but i hope things will change cause i know Iam not going to stop fighting till we have those right cause by my ex kids i was just always a freind of their mother who went to pick them up if they got sick at school :~(
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Uli
1/3/2012 05:00:26 pm
Age is kind of my topic. Since I'm married to a 18 years older lesbian age is always a point of discussion. We have 3 years old twin toddlers which makes it sometimes even more difficult...
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Susan
1/4/2012 09:11:50 am
I love this idea as well...in fact, a lesbian couple I know have mentioned that they would like to have a sort of retirement community for gay women...they can afford to do something along those lines and I hope they do...I would if I had the money to get something like that up and running...
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Deborah Stearns
1/4/2012 10:15:34 pm
I am in school now to obtain my LPN / RN degree. My brother (who is also gay is an RN). We both believe that caring for an elderly gay patient is a huge issue. What area are you in? Maybe we should be friends. :)
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Deborah Stearns
1/4/2012 10:15:34 pm
I am in school now to obtain my LPN / RN degree. My brother (who is also gay is an RN). We both believe that caring for an elderly gay patient is a huge issue. What area are you in? Maybe we should be friends. :)
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1/4/2012 01:56:00 am
I don't know that the lesbian community is any different from the straight community when it comes to the differences between generations. Older people, regardless of orientation, say that the younger generation doesnt appreciate what they've got, etc. The younger generation says the older generation doesnt understand what's happening now and is stuck in the past.
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I work for an eldercare referral service and I can tell you that AS A CULTURE we do not value or care for our elders. Assisted Living is expensive and not many can afford it. Older lesbians tend to be more isolated than their straight counterparts from their family of origin, are less likely to have children to care for them and do have more health problems, statistically speaking. There are a few LGBT-focused retirement communities, but they are far-flung and may not be affordable for everyone. I wish I had the answer for how to fix it, but I don't. I'm 44 - not that far from being "older" myself. I think that we definitely SHOULD care for our elders but that isn't the cultural norm. I also have no idea how to change THAT. Interesting post.
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Lori C
1/5/2012 10:17:57 am
Humans are prejudiced. Bottom line. About race, gender, age, size, whatever. We are no different as lesbians, butch or femme, young or old. Humans are egocentric. So we believe that we know best, whether we are young or old. However, as a butch 50 year old lesbian, I have come to realize that there is no way around the simple fact that all humans have a particular developmental path. Part of that path is learning to be more compassionate and less prejudiced as we grow into elder-hood. Some of us achieve a better sense of acceptance as we age, some do not.
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Leigh
7/5/2012 04:21:30 pm
I am a young 20 year old soft butch lesbian. I am always treated poorly by older lesbians. They dirty look me or talk about me saying I'm too young and not gay/unsure of my sexuality(I am gay).If i see some older lesbians I try to talk to them but I get pushed away. I respect older lesbians but I dont see why they treat me so poorly. Yea I'm young but I'm still learning about myself,women,sex,life,and so on. I look up to older lesbian couples. Expecially the couples that have been together for many years.
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