Butch Wonders
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He, She, We, They, Hir, Ze, Huh?!

9/26/2011

10 Comments

 
As is often the case, Butch 360 made me think--this time about pronouns.  I shared my own preferences in that post, so I won't bother to recount them here.  But I was struck by the marvelous diversity of preferences among the contributors.  And it made me wonder what you, dear readers, experience with regard to pronouns.  To that end, I made the following poll.  I hope you'll participate, comment, enjoy, revel, etc.
10 Comments
Holly Wolfchild
9/26/2011 09:11:23 am

overall it does not bother me what people call me. I think it's fun depending on how I dress that day and see what I get called the most. :)

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rachel link
9/26/2011 10:23:43 am

I think folks should communicate thier preferences and not assume. It annoys the crap outta my gf to get called 'he' or 'sir' and folks do it ALL THE TIME. For different reasons, some assume she's a guy, others that she id's masculine. Its easier if you just ask.

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Alex
9/26/2011 11:20:17 am

It used to be that people would ask what my preference is. Now they just assume male pronouns and I have to tell them that I prefer female pronouns. I really hate that when there is an assumption, it's male.

That said, I'm into BDSM and am more flexible about pronouns when in scene. I like being called boi but it's a female-oriented term for me in the same way butch is.

I also cringe at the they/them thing; the first time I heard someone describing their they/them preference I just kept thinking about dissociative identity disorder.

"It" is also a popular pronoun around here.

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W
9/26/2011 11:31:31 am

My dgf is moderately butch (idenifies more as "dykie"), & gets very offended when "misgender-ized", if you will.

On a slightly inappropiate note, she has DD's! Even in men's clothing, they're tough to miss! It bothers me as well when people don't immediately recognize her as the lovely female she is!

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Levi link
9/27/2011 01:27:32 pm

Growing up I always got really upset when people "he"d and "sir"red me. I made a conscious decision to stop correcting people when I was about 20, because I was curious and also because I wanted to start presenting more masculinely and knew I was going to have to get used to it. It hurt pretty badly for a while, but now I'm used to it... and unfortunately, I've somehow lost the ability to correct people. The words used to just jump out without thinking; now they stick in my throat.

Also now when strangers "she" me I check whether my chest is showing and get kind of put out. And I roll my eyes when people "sir" me, but I also smile. At the same time, I like the dissonance of being a "she" who looks like this. I'm confus[ed/ing], essentially.

I think I might prefer gender-neutral pronouns (ze/hir, ey/em/eir, or whatever), but no one will use them for me so it's hard to tell. People are way more willing and able to use "they" than any other gender-neutral pronoun, so though I see that you don't like it I can't say I agree.

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Joz
9/28/2011 05:28:54 am

A pronoun is a shortcut to using the person's actual name every time.

To have to ask the person what their pronoun preference is before engaging in conversation in your presence, makes it not a shortcut at all, but rather "A very awkward, not-sure-if-appropriate, long-cut." To expect that I should stop normal talking to another person, and do this for you, is like asking me to roll out a red carpet for you. But you don't want to be treated "Differently" -- just cannot win, can I?

How about this: quit getting angry about pronouns. If somebody makes a mistake, gently correct them. Chances are they will remember and get it right next time. It's hard enough to remember your NAME.

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Levi
9/29/2011 03:09:29 am

Jeez, Joz. You've never had someone call you by the wrong pronoun, have you? Or maybe you're one of the people who just doesn't care. I can respect that, but some of us DO care, and it hurts. It's not that hard to avoid pronoun use if you're not sure and don't want to ask.

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Joz
9/29/2011 05:53:50 am

Levi, I have, and I do care, or else I wouldn't read and comment on blogs about gender identity and presentation. There are some who will get offended if you just met them and you stop and ask what pronoun - it can sound like digging, as in "what are you anyway" - which could make someone with a chip on their shoulder angry all the same (OMG why does everyone question me and single me out...)

If I am otherwise nice and friendly, I don't think I should be on someones shit list for slipping a wrong pronoun. I'd like to be corrected and then move on to becoming friends.

I think language is for communicating and not for labeling/categorization, unless you are a taxonomist or a writer of a textbook. In the spirit of everyone getting along I just wish people wouldn't have chips on their shoulders about small stuff. And the pronoun, it is small.

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Joz
9/29/2011 09:31:29 pm

And BTW that was totes ad homineum to attack me on "never been called a wrong pronoun, probs." Hundreds of times, I have. It doesn't matter to me, is what I'm trying to say. What matters is us queers getting along, first of all, with all us other queers, and then, hopefully thanks to Ellen and Chaz and the like, with the homophobic mainstream that is our voting majority. I just hope that one day, everyone knows someone who is queer, and realizes we aren't trying to sodomize their children. I dunno, this is just kind of my goal, and I don't have a lot of interest in fighting with you guys/gals, hence my apparent disinterest that isn't.

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lib
8/7/2014 03:03:21 pm

I like this gender nuetral ze hir hirs idea, but.. And this may be just my New Zealand, but 'hir' would be pronounced the same as 'her' lol. How do you guys pronouce it because this cant be right?

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